Pop singer Chappell Roan made waves this week with her comments about motherhood. In a podcast interview, Roan—who had a conservative Christian upbringing in Missouri but is now a lesbian who flaunts a drag aesthetic—talked about her friends back home who have “very different lives” as parents of kids under 5. She compared their experience to “hell” and said (of parents of little kids), “I have not met anyone who’s happy, anyone who has light in their eyes, anyone who’s slept.”

Roan’s comments drew plenty of ire, but her rather low view of motherhood isn’t uncommon. Modern culture devalues motherhood and child-rearing—often pitting these things against prospects of career success and overall happiness. Even if the data indicates the opposite is true (surveys show married moms are generally the happiest), many young women today buy into the false cultural narrative that having kids is less valuable than having a career, or that the former can only be a hindrance to the latter. As a result, more and more young people postpone marriage and kids—or avoid it entirely. The result is a growing global fertility crisis which will have dire long-term consequences.

In a new Gospelbound episode, Collin Hansen chats with Nadya Williams about the contemporary cultural narrative on motherhood and kids. Williams—author of the new book Mothers, Children, and the Body Politic—laments the way motherhood is being “erased” and children are demeaned as costly drains and obstacles to happiness. In the ancient world, and still today, Christianity counters this narrative by asserting the “priceless” dignity of children. The question Williams raises for the church today is: are we being shaped more by the cultural narrative on this topic? Or by our own faith’s narrative?